June 13, 2002 4 PM - 6:30 PM EST
[17:32] <@Thunderfall> <mauiduck> Thanks for answering my questions guys. Aloha to all and thanks for all the mod abilities. I can't wait fot PTW. See you all around the CivFan forum
[17:32] <@gonzo_for_civ> im not sure if this is a repeat: Will it be possible to build a navy in the same manner that you can build an army with a GL
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[17:33] <@theGreyFox> <[-ISAK-]> Will there be a way to make Improvements obsolete, like you can with Wonders ??? (Hope, beg, grovel)
[17:33] <@PaleHorse76> Thanks alot guys
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[17:33] <+Jeffrey_Morris_FIRAXIS> one last question.
[17:33] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> ColdFever: Civ3 and PTW will be separate apps. I don't know if we will continue to patch civ3 after ptw or not... not my decision.
[17:33] <@Thunderfall> Jeff, Mike, and Javier have answered so many questions today! :)
[17:33] <@theGreyFox> <Lovro> "suggestion: espionage should definitely be revisited... one of the down points of the game :("
[17:34] <@Thunderfall> Easy question: <maniacalmonkey> Are there any prescription drugs to counter the "one more turn" syndrome?
[17:34] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> ISAK - maybe. Not sure yet.
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[17:34] <+Javier_Sobrado_Firaxis> heh, sorry i've been afkish. thanks for having us :)
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[17:34] <@Thunderfall> <King_of_Camelot> Someone had the idea for a canal like improvement, any thing like this in PTW?
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[17:34] <@Pale_away_must_sleep> Good bye Firaxians....I must get sleep, I need to get up in 4 hours :D
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[17:35] <+Jeffrey_Morris_FIRAXIS> King: No but not for lack of trying. We jsut never foudn a way that was useful and couldn't be better accomplished with a city.
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[17:35] <@Thunderfall> Should we remove the moderation now, GF?
[17:35] <@Thunderfall> <Montezuma> Is in plans Russian localization?
[17:35] <@theGreyFox> This was great, I thank you Firaxis, and please consider myself as a doormat if you need any, or a wallpaper or anything else...
[17:35] <@Pale_away_must_sleep> [-ISAK-]> To the Team: Guys you are the best, even though you wont make promises - thnx a lot ;-)
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[17:35] <@theGreyFox> <swervin> could we have the option to have the .BIC file set or "changeable"? also, any chance of terraforming ability for the workers?
[17:35] <@theGreyFox> tarpoon> will you be able to move your troops on fields with troops of your allies or allied towns?
[17:35] <+Jeffrey_Morris_FIRAXIS> That's it for me guys. Thanks a lot for coming and keeping interest in Civ3 alive. Have a great weekend and let's do this again once the patche gets released. See ya around.
[17:35] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> Montezuma: I don't know. Localization is Infogrames' decision.
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[17:35] <@theGreyFox> Endureth> Fortresses should have a ZOC that prevents enemy units form moving from one adjacent square to another adjacent square. Like the movement rules in Alpha Centari. It only makes sense and makes them that much more valuable to build. The whole point behind a fortress is to keep people out.
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[17:36] <@Thunderfall> A big thanks to all the Firaxians for coming.
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[17:36] <@Thunderfall> and answered so many quetsions!
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[17:36] <IHATEmedschool> AAAARRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGHHHHHHHHHH
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[17:36] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> swervin: Probably not since changing the BIC file during a game messes up the internal structure.
[17:36] <Theseus> Has anything been done about AI use of artillery and fastmover attackers?
[17:36] <maniacalmonkey> *phew*
[17:36] <chiefP> thanks
[17:36] <@gonzo_for_civ> mike, could you answer one last question from me, im not sure if it's repeat but will it be possible to build navies in the same manner you can build armies.
[17:36] <@gonzo_for_civ> ?
[17:36] <@Thunderfall> Everyone can talk now. :)
[17:36] <@Thunderfall> Free for all!!! :)
[17:36] <m_m_x> that was fun...
[17:36] <mjs0> Will we be able to continue a LAN-based MP game as a play-by-email if we run out of time?
[17:36] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> gonzo: no plans to do so at the moment.
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[17:36] <@theGreyFox> Thanks Mike, and tell the other firaxians they are foing a great job!
[17:36] <m_m_x> nice chat thunder
[17:36] <@Pale_away_must_sleep> Oh, last question from me: Is there anyway you could make it so the auto saves go past the current number now? Meaning you can keep them all automatically? (even if this is not a default setting it would be nice)
[17:36] <maniacalmonkey> no kidding :)
[17:36] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> mjs0- Yes
[17:36] <@gonzo_for_civ> thanks mike :)
[17:36] <furry> thanks for answerin the questions guys
[17:36] <Lovro> ok, all the non-regulars may leave now :)
[17:36] <Mithrander> Hey No one ever answered the combat question???!!!
[17:36] <Montezuma> Thanks FIRAXIANS!
[17:37] <@Thunderfall> We definitely will have more chats in the future.
[17:37] <rmsharpe> Just wondering...have Firaxians ever played Civilization: Call to Power (I or II), and did you intend to use any features or ideas from the CtP duo?
[17:37] <Lovro> "irregulars", that;d be
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[17:37] <kingjoshi> Mike: If you want any help in the editor, I work for free :)
[17:37] <@Thunderfall> The first time is always the most difficult step.
[17:37] <Melanic> Thanks for answering our questions.
[17:37] <@Thunderfall> :)
[17:37] <@gonzo_for_civ> :)
[17:37] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> Pale: I don't know. The next patch is removing the compression from the auto-saves so that folder could grow in size tremendously. I'll look into it though.
[17:37] <Mithrander> I still think combat is like Civ1
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[17:37] <Theseus> Mike, any answer on AI combat?
[17:37] <rmsharpe> Oh yeah, thanks for answering all the questions :P
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[17:37] <rmsharpe> I mean :)
[17:37] <Lovro> removing compression? why?
[17:37] <ErixTr> Thanks for the answers
[17:37] <@theGreyFox> NOw I got some work with the Log to do ;) :D
[17:37] <Lovro> we worked so hard to beat it?
[17:37] <swervin> it was fine on my system :) how about brining back the terraforming ability?
[17:37] * @Thunderfall 1,[ 8,4News Flash1,4 ] Moderation is off now. Everyone can post now. :)
[17:37] <Mithrander> thanxs mike
[17:37] <Lovro> no question mark there
[17:38] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> Lovro: Only on auto-saves. The compression slows down the game too much
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[17:38] <kingjoshi> Mike: what does it take to get an internship at Firaxis?
[17:38] <Lovro> oh, figures
[17:38] <[-ISAK-]> Mike B: Diid you ever get around to fix the problem with the Improvement art in the Build Queue button not showing up??
[17:38] <maniacalmonkey> Please tell me there will be a cure for the "just one more turn" syndrome - or therapy or anything - I haven't slept for MONTHS!
[17:38] <furry> One last question if you guy can answer this, do you plan on sticking some of the Alpha centauri diplomacy in the game? Such as please end your war with my friend so and so
[17:38] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> kingjjoshi: send in your resume. Check out www.firaxis.com for details.
[17:38] <rmsharpe> king - single female, 18-45 ;)
[17:38] <furry> you guys*
[17:38] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> rmsharpe - lol
[17:38] <@Thunderfall> lol
[17:38] <kingjoshi> lol @ rmsharpe
[17:38] <Mithrander> later civers
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[17:39] <Theseus> Single female with beer.
[17:39] <MuddyOne> Thanks for the time :)
[17:39] <Eejag> me gonna leave now
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[17:39] <Lovro> mike, staying for a while?
[17:39] <Melanic> <Jeffrey_Morris_FIRAXIS> Mel: The same way the americans do, by constructing wonders. The Koreans are in! I tricked him!
[17:39] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> for a bit... otherwise I have to go back to implementing mod management ;)
[17:39] <Melanic> I feel kind of guilty though...
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[17:40] <kingjoshi> Mike, the AI for shortest path is messed up. For example, it doesn't consider the current location as a possible move, will that be fixed in the patch?
[17:40] <@gonzo_for_civ> lol @ melanic
[17:40] <@Thunderfall> hey Mike, do u know PTW will add the civil war featrure back? (aka Civ split)
[17:40] <Montezuma> Jeff, idea: war internment wokers return with peace
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[17:40] <furry> aight see ya all
[17:40] <@Thunderfall> cya furry
[17:40] <Guest39830> is that mod thing lifted or not?
[17:40] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> king: I'm not sure.
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[17:40] <swervin> Mr. B, what about brining back terraforming? any chance?
[17:40] <isufan2006> I need to get going thanks for all the answers
[17:40] <@gonzo_for_civ> tf, you may want to change the current topic now
[17:40] <m_m_x> mike-has your work on the editor (for ptw) changed fundamental things in civ core code?
[17:40] <@Thunderfall> yeah, it's lifted now.
[17:40] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> TF: I don't think so.
[17:40] <@Thunderfall> :(
[17:40] <Theseus> I noticed you said Soren did not participate much... does that mean minimal changes to the AI?
[17:40] <Guest39830> can anyone read this?
[17:40] <mjs0> Any chance I will be able to add second level buildings to the build queue before first level have been built, e.g. Queue up library followed by University
[17:40] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> swervin: no plans at the moment.
[17:40] <@Thunderfall> Civ-split was so much fun...
[17:40] <swervin> ok, thanks
[17:41] <@gonzo_for_civ> yes guest, moderation is off :)
[17:41] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> Theseus: That's true.
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[17:41] <kingjoshi> Mike: I've noticed several errors with the Shortest Path Algorithm, was there concessions made for speed?
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[17:41] <chiefP> Mike, is coming to chats fun, or more work than fun?
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[17:41] <Lovro> kingjoshi, Dijkstra w/ heaps should work just fine
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[17:41] <Lovro> if it was the one implemented
[17:41] <Montezuma> Firaxians, idea for implementing internment
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[17:41] <m_m_x> btw guys warcraft3 has gone gold!
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[17:42] <kingjoshi> Lovro, but something is wrong, and that's the problem
[17:42] <@Thunderfall> another quetsion... will PTW come with an updated manual? the Civ3 manual we have now has some pretty obsolete info...
[17:42] <@Pale_away_must_sleep> loaded questions chiefp :) Answer it right Mike or forever alienate your customers!! ;)
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[17:42] <chiefP> seems like an interrogation to me :)
[17:42] <@Thunderfall> WC3 screenshots look realy cool.
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[17:42] <@Thunderfall> PH is sleep talking!? :D
[17:42] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> TF: I assume it will but I don't have any say in the manual creation. Manuals are frequently inaccurate since they are printed long before a game's release.
[17:42] <[-ISAK-]> Mike: Sorry - repeating myself is getting to be a habit :-) Has the problem with the build queue button been fixed/will it be fixed ??
[17:42] <@Thunderfall> ok
[17:42] * reddZ hugs thunderfall!
[17:43] <Lovro> oh i think i know what you mean
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[17:43] <Lovro> with the railroads, right?
[17:43] <Guest17206> So no AI changes... how about game balance issues? Like the commerical trait and the tech rate? Can we give up hope of you guys tweaking these in the patch?
[17:43] <swervin> 5thanks for answering my questions Mr. B and thanks for a great game. later everybody
[17:43] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> ISAK- I think that will be fixed in the next patch.
[17:43] <@Thunderfall> later swerin
[17:43] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> Minimal AI changes.. not none.
[17:43] <kingjoshi> Mike, Do you use C/C++ for the editor? or how does that work?
[17:43] <King_of_Camelot> Have we given you a headache from all our questions yet mike?
[17:43] <swervin> later Thunder ...
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[17:43] <@theGreyFox> mike, when was the patch released, after Testing right?
[17:44] <reddZ> ping me
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[17:44] <rmsharpe> Quick question: any chance of putting in an alternative graphic to the railroad, maybe highways?
[17:44] <[-ISAK-]> Mike: Great thanks - I'll stop bugging you then, and get back to modding :-) Thanks for taking the time - much appreciated :goodjob:
[17:44] <ummmmmm> what is this?
[17:44] <@Thunderfall> I don't understahd why Firaxis chose not to include Fundy gov't... If it's too powerful, why not make it less powerful??
[17:44] <Montezuma> FIraxians plz answer q : Internment
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[17:44] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> I don't think the designers liked the Fundy govt. type.
[17:44] <ummmmmm> i keep getting this message saying list permission denied, you do not have the required privelages
[17:44] <ummmmmm> whats up with that?
[17:44] <@gonzo_for_civ> jeez... we ask a lot of questions :P
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[17:45] <rmsharpe> Answer our questions, or die! And...have a nice day :D
[17:45] <kingjoshi> Anyone know if they answered whether railroad movement can be changed in the upcoming editor?
[17:45] <ummmmmm> and can anyone read this
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[17:45] <@Thunderfall> ..such as give it twice as much units taht require no support fee.
[17:45] <King_of_Camelot> yes ummmmmm
[17:45] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> Internment?
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[17:45] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> RR movement? no plans to change it at this time.
[17:45] <maniacalmonkey> oh YES I want railroad movement to be changed too...
[17:45] <maniacalmonkey> you can change road movement after all...
[17:46] <ummmmmm> ah thanks king
[17:46] <rmsharpe> Am I the only one that doesn't have a problem with the railroad movement?
[17:46] <Lovro> mike, many people wish to have a "railroad movement factor" in there
[17:46] <Montezuma> Yeah return workers after war without capital role
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[17:46] <@theGreyFox> they mean changeable
[17:46] <Lovro> like moving across railroads would take 1/6 of a movement point
[17:46] <ummmmmm> may i be permitted a question or actually a group questions my lord mike?:P
[17:46] <rmsharpe> It shouldn't take more than a year to get a tank from Paris to Moscow :\
[17:46] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> Montezuma: interesting idea but no plans for that right now.
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[17:46] <Montezuma> ok
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[17:47] <kingjoshi> Mike, will we ever get to see the Wishlist?
[17:47] <Montezuma> rmsharpe from Berlin to Moscow?
[17:47] <Lovro> "no comment", kingjoshi ;)
[17:47] <@theGreyFox> do you take notes or anything on Ideas from chats?
[17:47] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> kingjoshi> probably not.. it keeps growing :)
[17:47] <ummmmmm> hey
[17:48] <civ2lover> ok
[17:48] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> GreyFox: yes. Anything that's really easy to implement, I usually sneak in.
[17:48] <rmsharpe> Montezuma, not during attacking, I mean between two friendly cities.
[17:48] <civ2lover> now I've got question
[17:48] <civ2lover> can i ask it ?
[17:48] <MuddyOne> king- think he is going to give people a list of things to complain about :)
[17:48] <kingjoshi> lol
[17:48] <@gonzo_for_civ> ask away civ2lover
[17:48] <civ2lover> ok
[17:48] <civ2lover> thanks
[17:48] <@gonzo_for_civ> just don't scare him :)
[17:48] <Montezuma> ok rmsharp
[17:48] <@gonzo_for_civ> or us :)
[17:48] <civ2lover> may i enquire as to who will the leaders of the new civs be?
[17:49] <maniacalmonkey> Mike - can I ask you to give just a little thought to "base rights"? It would make wars against distant civs so much easier :)
[17:49] <civ2lover> civ leaders
[17:49] <@Thunderfall> I think Mike don't mind me to reveal that units that have created a Great leader will have * symbol. :)
[17:49] <civ2lover> not great leaders
[17:49] <rmsharpe> And just don't ask about terrorism...PaleHorse is about to get out his Modern Armor ;)
[17:49] <@Thunderfall> This was suggested in the forum...
[17:49] <@gonzo_for_civ> they are keepign that top secret civ2lover:)
[17:49] <cd21> has there ever been any thought given to releasing source code to civ1 or 2?
[17:49] <civ2lover> grrrrrrrrrrrrr...
[17:49] <@gonzo_for_civ> so that they don't give away who the civ's will be
[17:49] <civ2lover> no clues whatsoever
[17:49] <civ2lover> ?
[17:49] <Lovro> civ2lover, you'll get a "wait and see" answer, it has been asked
[17:49] <Lovro> and answered ;)
[17:49] <@gonzo_for_civ> we think korea will be there because someone tricked jeff :)
[17:49] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> civ2lover: I don't know if we are talking about the leaders right now.. other than Genghis and Isabella (Mongols and Spanish)
[17:50] <King_of_Camelot> Mike, with multiplayer, how is it going to handle graphic changes, for scenerio type games, or is graphic changing over multiplayer out of the question?
[17:50] <@Thunderfall> we already know most fo the Civs... and Jeff said Hwacha is not from the Japan unit pack...
[17:50] <Bolan> Will it still be possible for a city to flip after an (almost) defeated civ respawns even if you'e far ahead in culture points
[17:50] <Montezuma> medieval infantry are so redudant I love crossbowman as ofenzive
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[17:50] <kingjoshi> Mike, have you played Civ3 with the DYP mod?
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[17:50] <rmsharpe> So...Mike...would you say that the new expansion pack has more Seoul than the original Civ3? ;)
[17:50] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> TF: You will also be able to rename units that generate leaders.
[17:50] <civ2lover> but i thought you annouced who the other civs would be?
[17:50] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> lol @ rmsharpe
[17:50] <@gonzo_for_civ> lol rmsharpe :D
[17:50] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> we've only announced Mongols and Spanish at this time....
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[17:51] <civ2lover> ah ok
[17:51] <notyoueither> and Andorians.
[17:51] <@Thunderfall> lol
[17:51] <Chaosrik> Mike, what do you think of DYP?
[17:51] <civ2lover> so the rumors we heard are unsubstantiated i guess :P
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[17:51] <rmsharpe> It also looks like the Vikings are there, too.
[17:51] <TBay_rangers85> Mike, is there any way to make Genghis a little less, ummmm, ugly, he looks scary :)
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[17:51] <civ2lover> ok
[17:51] <Lovro> TF, could you /topic "After party"? :)
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[17:51] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> King_of_camelot: I'm not sure about this yet (I haven't yet implemented it) but I think eahc player may be required to have the graphics for those scenarios.
[17:51] <civ2lover> hmmmmmmmmmmmmm
[17:51] <eagles4ever> hello all
[17:51] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> TBay: I like Genghis
[17:52] <kingjoshi> hi eagles
[17:52] <maniacalmonkey> Mike: Will the AI rename it's units that spawn leaders?
[17:52] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> maniacalmonkey: No
[17:52] <civ2lover> ok would you think about returning the civil war feature from civ2?
[17:52] <TBay_rangers85> I know I wouldn't mess with him if I saw him :)
[17:52] *** Pale_away_must_sleep changes [topic] to 'Firaxis Chat After Party!!'
[17:52] *** ChanServ changes [topic] to 'Firaxis Chat TODAY at 4 PM EST! (Thunderfall)'
[17:52] <civ2lover> and why did you remove it in the first place
[17:52] <rmsharpe> Genghis looks like he's been eating one too many of his enemies :P
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[17:52] <@Pale_away_must_sleep> I canna change :(
[17:52] <@gonzo_for_civ> now PH is sleep topic changing
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[17:52] <@Thunderfall> Oh yeah, some people have protested about the ugly depiction of GenghisK... hopefully the Firaxis art team can give him a more dignifed look./ :)
[17:52] <@gonzo_for_civ> but TF has an auot prog on
[17:53] <@Pale_away_must_sleep> sucka!
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[17:53] <@Pale_away_must_sleep> well, let me really go to sleep then
[17:53] <Lovro> yeah, it's called "ChanServ" ;)
[17:53] <Lovro> bye, ph!
[17:53] <@Thunderfall> Bye PH
[17:53] <eagles4ever> 3 hello
[17:53] <@Thunderfall> Have a good night sleep
[17:53] <Chaosrik> Mike, how about letting us know how to implement custom birds-eye view graphics?
[17:53] <rmsharpe> See ya, Thunder.
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[17:53] <@Thunderfall> cya
[17:53] <Lovro> lol w/ rmsharpe
[17:54] <rmsharpe> Hey, I don't think anyone asked this, but how many zoom views will there be in the editor and game?
[17:54] <@Thunderfall> Chaosrik: it's quite easy to change those graphics... Just look in the relevant folder inside Art.
[17:54] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> Chaosrik: I haven't been able to figure that out for myself!
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[17:54] <eagles4ever> 3 can't find aserver to play call to power 2. PLEASE HELP
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[17:54] <maniacalmonkey> Will the chance of spawning a leader be changeable in the editor?
[17:54] <kingjoshi> rmsharpe, they said just the two currenlty implemented
[17:54] <Graeme999> Any plans to implement satelites? They would launch from a city and orbit say 80 turns, you can see each turn what is "under" the satelite. I loved that in the old unix empire game...
[17:54] <Lovro> lol... "call to power"
[17:54] <chiefP> I want to encourage chatters here to use the CFC chat here more often. You can always ask me questions! :)
[17:54] <@Thunderfall> Mike, are u at home or in the office?
[17:54] <rmsharpe> Oh, so, there's not going to be any zoom options in the editor?
[17:55] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> rmsharpe: In the editor you have the following zoom levels: 25%, 50%, 75%, 100%, 150%, 200%, 500%.
[17:55] <Lovro> we could use more regulars
[17:55] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> TF: office
[17:55] <rmsharpe> Ahhh, huzzah
[17:55] <_nitrous_> is the ptw going to have all the governments like CTP
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[17:55] <rmsharpe> That'll make things much easier.
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[17:55] <rmsharpe> nitrous - no
[17:55] <ChrTh> Wow, the chat's still going on?
[17:55] <Montezuma> Mike will be civil leaders?
[17:55] <Bolan> Will it still be possible for an unconnected enemy capitol to culturally take over one of your own cities?
[17:55] <rmsharpe> I asked about any new governments...none so far.
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[17:55] <Lovro> afterparty, chrth
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[17:55] <maniacalmonkey> what'll be the use of zooming to 500%???
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[17:55] <rmsharpe> Count the pixels on uranium, of course!
[17:55] <ChrTh> Kewl
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[17:55] <maniacalmonkey> lol
[17:56] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> manicalmonkey: The artists didn't like it. It has no practical use.
[17:56] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> That;s the only reason I put it in.
[17:56] <@theGreyFox> hehe
[17:56] <Theseus> I may have missed it... how about zoom in the game itself?
[17:56] <@Pale_away_must_sleep> The artists didn't like it but it will be in anyways
[17:56] <ChrTh> So did anyone let slip what the other Civs were :)
[17:56] <@theGreyFox> that's the spirit!
[17:56] <Lovro> engineers vs. designers :)
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[17:56] <Lovro> go engingeers!
[17:56] <@Thunderfall> it never hurts to add more options to the game. :)
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[17:57] <kingjoshi> Mike, who gives you more requests, artists or the designers?
[17:57] <maniacalmonkey> I was afraid we'd get a peek at the bitter animosities within a software company :)
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[17:57] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> king: the designers of course.
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[17:57] <Theseus> Sorry, zoom in the game itself?
[17:57] <@theGreyFox> am I the only person in the world with interests in both programming AND the art part ANd Design?
[17:57] <super_george_bush> aaaaah
[17:57] <ChrTh> Yes
[17:57] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> Actually, forum users give the most requests...
[17:57] <rmsharpe> Do programmers get an edge up on playing because they designed it? :)
[17:57] <Lovro> pretty much, gf
[17:57] <kingjoshi> Mike, I assume the fans give more then them combined :)
[17:57] <ChrTh> lol
[17:57] <kingjoshi> lol
[17:57] <super_george_bush> with the power to sign treaties with russia, super bush!
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[17:58] <rmsharpe> I don't want to play against anyone that made it...too afraid...to...be...squashed ;)
[17:58] <super_george_bush> hey all
[17:58] <kingjoshi> Grey, I'm only interested in programming and Design, no art for me
[17:58] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> rmsharpe: Usually the designers have an edge but not really the programmers. I kind of suck at the game, personally.
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[17:58] <rmsharpe> Heh-heh, you and me both :P
[17:58] <ChrTh> Mike: Add a "Poker" feature to the game...make it an easter egg, where you can play Hoyle Poker against the other Civ leaders :)
[17:58] <Bolan> Will the multplayer version have a 'team death match' option?
[17:58] <Lovro> lol
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[17:59] <Chaosrik> Mike, when will the expansion for Civ 3 be released? Sorry if I missed the answer earlier.
[17:59] <Lovro> aeson, any lessons for mr. Mike here? :)
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[17:59] <maniacalmonkey> I would play poker with Joan :)
[17:59] * super_george_bush wants the editor patch bad
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[17:59] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> Chaosrik: Sometime in autumn or winter. Not sure about exact release date.
[17:59] <Chaosrik> ok, thanks.
[17:59] <rmsharpe> Try June 15th.
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[17:59] <Chaosrik> would be nice!!
[17:59] <super_george_bush> tomorrow?!
[18:00] <Montezuma> Mike, i love 'boss' feature in game when going boss in room
[18:00] <super_george_bush> sweet
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[18:00] <IHATEmedschool> Hey Mike, why dont you add an option to see the city radiuses on the main map
[18:00] <IHATEmedschool> ?
[18:00] <rmsharpe> I knew someone would believe me :P
[18:00] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> rmsharpe: I don't think it would do very well if we released it tomorrow... ;)
[18:00] <super_george_bush> lol
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[18:00] <super_george_bush> ok
[18:00] <ChrTh> When is the first Civ of the Week for PTW gonna show up?
[18:00] <Dragoten> lol
[18:00] <Chieftess> That's what I want too. city radius
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[18:00] <Chieftess> But not like Civ2. :)
[18:00] <rmsharpe> Hey, I'd buy it!
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[18:00] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> Montezuma: Try alt-tab or windows-D
[18:00] <Lovro> you do resemble the real bush, sgb...
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[18:00] <kingjoshi> Mike, what are Javier referring to about playing Civ3 every Thursday?
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[18:00] <super_george_bush> :D
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[18:01] <IHATEmedschool> also, i gotta say, the manual isnt too good Mike, it aint very user friendly
[18:01] <Bolan> It would be cool to play a 6 vesus 6 multiplayer civ game. Will there be a 'team death match' option?
[18:01] <IHATEmedschool> sorry but thats the truth
[18:01] <Montezuma> I'm myself boss :) for friend only...
[18:01] <Chieftess> I
[18:01] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> king: we setup mp ptw every thursday to test the current functionality and balance and general "fun"
[18:01] <IHATEmedschool> for me at least
[18:01] * super_george_bush doesn't read the manual, he just plays it
[18:01] <Chieftess> I'd ask some questions, but I think tGF asked most of them for me already.
[18:01] <ChrTh> There's a manual?
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[18:01] <arkammler> I been gone for a hour and half, any new info?
[18:01] * Lovro says hi to chieftess and invites her to join #demogame
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[18:02] <@Thunderfall> I hope everyone visits the chat more often. The chat is open 24/7. :)
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[18:02] <super_george_bush> ha
[18:02] <kingjoshi> Mike, who usually wins those games?
[18:02] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> medschool: most game manuals are printed well before the game is done and are usually out-of-date by the time the game ships...
[18:02] <@Thunderfall> sorry lovro. :D
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[18:02] <Lovro> ahem?
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[18:02] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> king: No one yet. Victory isn't implemented for MP yet ;)
[18:02] <IHATEmedschool> i'm afraid i aint talking about inconsistancies
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[18:02] <IHATEmedschool> i'm talking about a lack of info
[18:02] <kingjoshi> lol, well at least you can't feel bad about yourself yet then :)
[18:02] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> medschool: It's the same problem though...
[18:02] * Silver slaps everyone in the room.
[18:02] <IHATEmedschool> yesterday i started playing for the first time
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[18:02] <Lovro> a little too many "useful features", Thunderfall? :P
[18:02] <IHATEmedschool> and with the manual
[18:02] <IHATEmedschool> it wasnt alot of help
[18:03] <super_george_bush> mike, are we currently going to do something about that poor ghengis khan's face?
[18:03] <@Thunderfall> Mike, please make it possible to set the starting date of a scenario. :)
[18:03] <IHATEmedschool> i was looking for alot of stuff
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[18:03] <Theseus> MIKE!!!! IS THERE MORE ZOOM IN THE GAME??!!
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[18:03] <IHATEmedschool> but couldnt find it
[18:03] <@Thunderfall> hehe
[18:03] <eagles4ever> IS CIV3 MULTIPLAYER?
[18:03] <super_george_bush> not yet eagles4ever
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[18:03] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> super_george: Probably not. We like Genghis.
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[18:03] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> Theseus: not in the game.
[18:03] <super_george_bush> in autumn/winter civ3 will be multiplayer (if you buy the XP)
[18:03] <ChrTh> Do his teeth get better in the Modern Age
[18:03] <arkammler> Mike, what are the abilities of the two known civ for ptw?
[18:03] <Montezuma> Oh, Mike, for Firaxis just need ChatMan positon for chatting everyday :)
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[18:03] <@Thunderfall> lol
[18:03] <maniacalmonkey> I like Ghandi - he looks like a bald parrot
[18:03] <kingjoshi> Mike, what else do you work on in the game besides the Editor?
[18:03] <Lovro> TF, could you disable it though? we don't want someone to fly just for mentioning hash-demogame
[18:03] <eagles4ever> DOES ANYONE PLAY CALL TO POWER 2 ONLINE ANYMORE?
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[18:04] <@Thunderfall> the auto-kick feature is only atcive when i am on. :)
[18:04] <Chieftess> Mike, just wondering, how'd you get your start in the gaming business? (I've been an aspiring Firaxian from the moment I played Civ1 (well, since Firaxis was created)) :)
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[18:04] <Chieftess> I live here in Baltimore, Co. BTW.
[18:04] <@Thunderfall> welcome Chiftess! :)
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[18:04] <Lovro> i know, but still... can't you decide its subfeatures?
[18:04] <rmsharpe> Well, gotta scram
[18:04] <rmsharpe> See ya
[18:04] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> I answered a job ad in the local newspaper in Pittsburgh, PA.
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[18:04] <super_george_bush> but mike, ghengis is hella ugly! he deserves better!!!!
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[18:04] <kingjoshi> Chieftess, I was wondering the same thing
[18:04] <Lovro> configure, rather than decide
[18:04] <IHATEmedschool> and one last Q, or more properly, a request, would you mind bringing back the civil war feature from civ2, where if you captured a rivals capital, his nation descended into civil war?
[18:05] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> Mongols: Militaristic and Expansionist, SPanish: Religious and commercial
[18:05] <Chieftess> Any experience? I'm just a recent college grad. I'm thinking of applying for that Absolute Quality (game testing) as a start.
[18:05] <kingjoshi> Mike, what requirements, besides being single female, 18-45 does it take to get an internship at Firaxis?
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[18:05] <notyoueither> Civil War is too vicious, IMO
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[18:05] <@Thunderfall> thanks for the info Mike
[18:05] <Chieftess> King: I seem to fit that desc.
[18:05] <super_george_bush> but it happens
[18:05] <Chieftess> I never got the intership though. :(
[18:05] <Chieftess> :)
[18:05] <Lovro> lol w/ chieftess
[18:06] <kingjoshi> Chieftess, good for you. Unfortunately for me, I'm headed to grad school for AI
[18:06] <OldMajor> w/ not @!!
[18:06] <@gonzo_for_civ> well, i got to go
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[18:06] <Lovro> bye gonzo
[18:06] <super_george_bush> ya know what mike, i'm about fifteen minutes from hunt valley
[18:06] <@gonzo_for_civ> thank you mike for answering all those questions
[18:06] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> lol @ kingjoshi. It depends whether it's for art or programming. For programming, we prefer to have college juniors or seniors who have shown some programming initiative outside of their schoolwork.
[18:06] <Chieftess> Same here. I just got back from work.
[18:06] <Chaosrik> Mike, have you played the Double Your Pleasure Mod for civ3?
[18:06] <@gonzo_for_civ> and thanks to the users for being so kind to the ops when asking us to aks questions :D
[18:06] * super_george_bush finds his paratroopers
[18:06] <@gonzo_for_civ> bye
[18:06] <Lovro> mike doesn't listen to you, oldmajor :(
[18:06] <kingjoshi> Yeah Mike, thanks for everything
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[18:06] <Chieftess> I was thinking of coming, but coming when I'm working just didn't seem right. :)
[18:07] <ColdFever> This chat really had many new infos. I have to work now to translate it for civ3.de. Thanks Mike and have a nice weekend. Goodnight from Germany.
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[18:07] <thomas_davie> Question about pbem in 'Play the World'. Will the turn files be encrypted? Sorry if this has been answered already,
[18:07] <@Thunderfall> bye Colodfever
[18:07] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> Chaosrik: no I haven't. I haven't played any mods. I downloaded Ed O' Wars zombie mod but haven't had time to play it yet :(
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[18:07] <NightRaider1> I need to run, enjoyed the chat
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[18:07] <kingjoshi> Mike, do you know who decides what user mods will be in?
[18:08] <@theGreyFox> chieftess: coming when working? Is it only my brain or...
[18:08] <kingjoshi> I assume Sid has the final say on everything :)
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[18:08] <Lovro> it's your brain, gf ;)
[18:08] <Chieftess> coming to the chat while I'm working. That's what I meant.
[18:08] <Chieftess> :)
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[18:08] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> thomas_davie: I don't know yet but I believe they will be.
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[18:08] <arkammler> Mike, what would you think of a custam(you pick) auto workers when they are autoing?
[18:08] <thomas_davie> thanks
[18:08] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> Chieftess: I'm chatting while I'm working...
[18:08] <Chieftess> No fair! :p
[18:08] <Lovro> lol
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[18:08] <arkammler> ooch
[18:08] <maniacalmonkey> Mike - I forgot to ask - which tech do you need to make guerillas availiable?
[18:09] <Chieftess> I wanna be a Firaxian too! ;)
[18:09] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> kingjoshi: Primarily up to Jeff and Barry/Speedbump
[18:09] <Chaosrik> Shouldn't that be whistling!!??
[18:09] <Lovro> no ct, don't turn to the dark side! :eek:
[18:09] <Chieftess> Mike: Will there be an option to see auto-workers?
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[18:09] <super_george_bush> mike: any word (that you can tell us) on the release date or even an approximation (other than "june") for the big editor patch?
[18:09] <IHATEmedschool> hi again
[18:09] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> maniacalmonkey: I'm not sure but I think they show up in the industrial age.
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[18:09] <Chieftess> And, I've noticed dots next to the workers in the city screen (sometimes). What are those? (some are by their heads, some the shoulder)
[18:10] <@Thunderfall> maybe you can set auto-workers to look something like automated cities...
[18:10] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> super_george: It's in test right now.
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[18:10] <super_george_bush> ok
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[18:10] <super_george_bush> kool
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[18:10] <super_george_bush> goodbye hello
[18:10] <IHATEmedschool> i asked this first, but i dont know wether you got this or not, but Mike, would you mind bringing back the civil war feature from civ2?
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[18:10] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> medschool: that's on the wishlist.
[18:10] <Lovro> from civ1 ;)
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[18:10] <Chieftess> same here. Make it more pliable for MP.
[18:10] <Soren> hello
[18:10] <@Thunderfall> hey Soren!
[18:10] <kingjoshi> Chieftess, have you done any game programming on your own? I wonder what those people did
[18:10] <Bean> oh no did I miss them
[18:11] *** Thunderfall [voices] Soren
[18:11] <+Soren> hi, I can only stay for about 20 minutes...
[18:11] <Chieftess> That is, making a new civ out of existing civs
[18:11] <IHATEmedschool> and is that a wish that is gonna come true or not?:P
[18:11] <@Thunderfall> you are late. :)
[18:11] <Lovro> Soren, what algo is used for the shortest paths?
[18:11] <Chieftess> king: Yes, I'm making an RPG editor now.
[18:11] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> medschool: wishlist = if there's time.
[18:11] <IHATEmedschool> aha
[18:11] <IHATEmedschool> i see
[18:11] <IHATEmedschool> thanks
[18:11] <IHATEmedschool> for the info
[18:11] <Chaosrik> Mike, how is the fix, for the limit of 80 improvements, coming along?
[18:11] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> TF: I told you, Soren's got other responsibilities now ;)
[18:11] <+Soren> well, it is a variation on A*... although we are switching to a pure A* in the next patch
[18:11] <super_george_bush> i was just playing a game as the romans
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[18:11] <+Soren> which should result in a speed up...
[18:11] <MuddyOne> Bean, Mike is still here- but it is offically over :)
[18:11] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> Chaosrik: should be fixed in the next patch
[18:11] <kingjoshi> wow, A* search for the shortest path algorithm?
[18:12] <Chaosrik> ok, thanks#
[18:12] <super_george_bush> (EDITED BIC) the naval units can move a bit (a lot) farther
[18:12] <+Soren> yep
[18:12] <Daniel1494> questions from a guy who just came in: ^^;; Will Guerrillas still be avaliable to liberate cities?
[18:12] <+Soren> how do I change my name
[18:12] <@Thunderfall> Mike: I thought so,.. Soren must be working on those TOP SECRET projects. :D
[18:12] <Chieftess> Can you add improvements/culture/food/population to cities in the editor?
[18:12] <Chieftess> next patch that is.
[18:12] <Lovro> A*? never heard of that. time complexity? (please don't tell me it's using fibonacci heaps or something like that ;) )
[18:12] <IHATEmedschool> one last q, why did you not add a tech poster to every copy of civ3 like you did with civ2?
[18:12] <kingjoshi> Soren, for naval units, they don't consider the current location as a possibility of the best vertex and waiting for the next turn
[18:12] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> Chieftess: yes... not sure about food yet though
[18:12] <+Soren> A*... go to gameai.com. there should be some articles there.
[18:13] <Bolan> Mike or soren: will there be a team death match in the multiplayer version, like 4 against four civs?
[18:13] <arkammler> Mike what do you think about have worker do tunnels and cannels, if they connent 2 tiles of non-hill/coast?
[18:13] <+Soren> it is pretty much the standard search algorithm nowadays.
[18:13] <Rambokalle> how about the nukes, is it possible to entirely destroy a city?
[18:13] <Lovro> thanks
[18:13] <kingjoshi> That causes a waste of a turn sometimes when you can't go over sea or ocean tiles
[18:13] <Chieftess> Mike: Will there be an option to add resources, and units?
[18:13] <Chieftess> I know I read techs will be added (I think in MP?)
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[18:13] * super_george_bush nuked egypt four times before he got here
[18:13] <kingjoshi> Do you guys ever go to gamasutra.com?
[18:13] <Dragoten> when will the next patch be out?
[18:13] <Bean> does anyone play with snoopy's graphics?
[18:13] <Chieftess> I do.
[18:14] <Chieftess> But 'modified'.
[18:14] <Chieftess> :)
[18:14] <super_george_bush> surprisingly it actually helped to weaken the defenses :D
[18:14] <kingjoshi> I use a blend of womoks and snoopies
[18:14] <+Soren> kingjoshi... yes, gamasutra is great
[18:14] <Dragoten> I dont like the new graphics for the mountains hehe
[18:14] <Chieftess> I leace the origanal jungles in.
[18:14] <Bean> have you noticed that the submarines don't match the new water color now
[18:14] <Chieftess> I love them. They remind me of my first RPG - Dragon Warrior 1 (Dragon Quest)
[18:14] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> Chieftess: yes. Anything that the game handle being added will be enabled now (that means you can add: citizens, civs, techs, culture, govt, improvements, resources, units)
[18:14] <Lovro> soren, could the algo be modified to work with "stepping onto railroads"
[18:14] <Chaosrik> Does anyone know if this whole chat log will be available to view at a later date?
[18:15] <kingjoshi> Soren, the worker sometimes goes into other civs territories when I don't have ROP with them, can you explain why?
[18:15] <Chieftess> I think it is.
[18:15] <+Soren> king... not sure what you meant with your naval ?
[18:15] <super_george_bush> probably chaos
[18:15] <Daniel1494> Speaking of terrain, will there be a Glacier type? ^.^; *If asked, sorry, but just came in/is a moron/all that*
[18:15] <kingjoshi> I mean naval units. a galley for example
[18:15] <IHATEmedschool> he means belly button
[18:15] <super_george_bush> YEA! more terrain! POWER TO THE PEOPLE! lol
[18:15] <Dragoten> Does anyone know when the next patch for civ3 will be out? (not the XP)
[18:15] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> daniel: no
[18:15] <Chieftess> I'd love to see a Viking Longboat.
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[18:15] <super_george_bush> darn
[18:15] <super_george_bush> lol
[18:15] <Chieftess> There needs to be more sea UUs. :)
[18:15] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> dragoten: it's in testing now. Not sure when it will pass though.
[18:15] <kingjoshi> Instead of taking a partial turn, and then crossing the sea, it uses up the whole turn and takes a longer route
[18:15] <+Soren> king... probably the worker is either going to another city or searching for irrigation (or maybe trying to build a colony somewhere?)
[18:15] <Dragoten> thanks
[18:16] <+Soren> sometimes they try to build a road to your capital...
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[18:16] <arkammler> thunder could you prodie(sp) a log of today's chat? and see you later.
[18:16] <@Thunderfall> Soren, I heard used to test AIs by setting the game to play by itself. Is it posisble to add this Watch mode to the game also? It would be interesting to watch the game play by itself w/ human intervention. :)
[18:16] <kingjoshi> Soren, but what can I do when they keep going into the other territory and the other leader complains and kicks them out and the process is repeated several turns?
[18:16] <Chaosrik> Will there be another Firaxis Chat sometime soon?
[18:16] <+Soren> the search algorithm is modified to deal with railroads... those really screw up the calculations. A* is not very efficient if the cost of all tiles i 0.
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[18:16] <@Thunderfall> Civ2 had this feature....
[18:17] <+Soren> is 0
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[18:17] <super_george_bush> i would love to see an APC so i can transport all of my marines/infantry w/o needing fifteen turns to use up for each (by then the war is over!!)
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[18:17] <Bean> just a suggestion but I think there should be more special units especially for civs like the English and Americans
[18:17] <Lovro> i realize that
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[18:17] <Lovro> but the "turn count" is wrong
[18:17] <maniacalmonkey> Soren or Mike - many people would like to see the option to forbid other civs to do stuff in diplomacy - like forbid them t make MPP's r RoP's with your mortal enemy - can this be implemented?
[18:17] <+Soren> yeah, having the AI plays itself is an invaluable tool for writing/debugging it. it is, however, only possible in the debug build.
[18:17] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> Bean: that's why we have an editor
[18:17] <notyoueither> Soren: Any plans to address the imbalance of AI Fast attackers vs Infantry?
[18:17] <Chieftess> BTW, will modern navy "speed" (moves) be increased? (I know the editor) :)
[18:17] <Lovro> you could just follow the path and count the turns required for the unit (once you find the path)
[18:18] <super_george_bush> mike: no add button in the editor yet :D
[18:18] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> super_george: stay tuned
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[18:18] <IHATEmedschool> oh yeah
[18:18] <super_george_bush> mike: i will
[18:18] <+Soren> oh, you mean your automated workers... I would recommend getting a RoP (obviously) beyond that maybe build workers near the city the automated workers are trying to get to.
[18:18] <Chieftess> Oh, another question/suggestion: Will there be an option (in the editor) to add "era values" to the eras. (that is, a multiplier for each era.
[18:19] <Chieftess> middle would have a base*2, ant. would be base*1.
[18:19] <IHATEmedschool> dont know if this feature is available or not, cause i havent gotten that far in my first game, but if it isnt, would you mind putting in a cease fire diplomatic status in like in civ2?
[18:19] <kingjoshi> What does it take to program AI in current games? will a masters or PhD be benificial in getting a job? I'm getting one regardless
[18:19] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> A multiplier of what?
[18:19] <IHATEmedschool> that was addressed to Mike of course
[18:19] <Chieftess> I really hate seeing spearmen beat my modern armor. :)
[18:19] <Chaosrik> Gotta go now, thanks Mike and everyone for your help :)
[18:19] <Chieftess> For attack/def.
[18:19] <super_george_bush> yeah. that would be cool
[18:19] <Bean> something I miss from Civ2 is when you captured an enemy capital city it threw their civ into disorder and sometimes split it into two civilizations
[18:19] <Chieftess> (I know, the editor, right) :)
[18:19] <@Thunderfall> "it is, however, only possible in the debug build." That's too bad. :(
[18:19] <kingjoshi> Soren, Yes, they were automated, but I planned on attacking that civ
[18:19] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> Oh, that's on the wishlist.
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[18:20] <+Soren> nye: unless I've missed something, we think we did balance it once we gave retreating a probability. I guess if you think it is too high, there is always the editor
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[18:20] <super_george_bush> give yourself a break from your current war to reorganize and relieve the war weariness in repubs/democracies :)
[18:20] <IHATEmedschool> what is ? The cease fire or just the civil war or both mike?
[18:20] <notyoueither> Soren. What I meant is the AI builds so few fast attackers now that Inf aree offensive.
[18:20] <@Thunderfall> Mike, do u think the patch will be released in June as annouced? or is it still tentative?
[18:20] <IHATEmedschool> on the wish list i mean
[18:20] <IHATEmedschool> i know civil war is
[18:20] <IHATEmedschool> but dont know if you were taking to me or who?
[18:21] <notyoueither> or so it seems
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[18:21] <super_george_bush> thunder, he said its being tested, so i guess it'll be out pretty soon
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[18:21] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> TF: still tentative. I woudl guess end of June at earliest. Our latest version to test broke a few things :(
[18:21] <+Soren> king: you've gotta be smart, have a strong CS background, and be willing to work hard. The challenge is getting the first job (I got my break as an intern at EA) The real trick is just to be persistent. A Masters or higher is not necessary, especially if you specialize in AI as an undergrad
[18:21] <@Thunderfall> ok... :)
[18:21] <+Soren> nye: I have been working on fixing that for the patch.
[18:21] <notyoueither> Yeah!
[18:21] <Chieftess> I may take an AI class myself..
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[18:22] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> medschool: both
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[18:22] <Chieftess> Luckily (shameless plug :)) the CCBC (comm. colleges of balto. co.) are going to be adding game dev. classes, I hear.
[18:22] <IHATEmedschool> oh good, thanks Mike
[18:22] <kingjoshi> AI is cool Chieftess, I still think it's the most important thing in a game nowadays
[18:22] <Bolan> Soren, are you planning to make some kind of team death match option in the multiplayer version, like 4 civs against 4 other civs?
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[18:22] <olearyma> hello everyone
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[18:22] <Lovro> hardest as well, king
[18:22] <Chieftess> I have some versions of AI strats. on paper.
[18:22] <kingjoshi> yeah, true Lovro
[18:22] <maniacalmonkey> *cough* - I'll just ask again :) In diplomacy many people would like to see more embargo-style options - like forbid a civ to make MPP/RoP with your mortal enemy, or demand they make peace with your friends - any chance of this ever being implemented?
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[18:23] <+Soren> bolan, well, you can ally with other civs. I'm not sure if we lock teams or anything. Mike?
[18:23] <ChrTh> Wow, still going strong, eh?
[18:23] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> maniacalmonkey: wishlist feature
[18:23] <Lovro> ct, you sound like a designer ;)
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[18:23] <super_george_bush> mike: how about improving the ai? sometimes, i offer it something for nothing in return and they refuse it!
[18:23] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> Bolan: we're not sure what we're going to do wiht team options yet.
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[18:23] <+Soren> maniac: we don't have plans for that. Interesting idea, though...
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[18:23] <maniacalmonkey> thanks :)
[18:23] <Chieftess> haha.. being self-taught has it's advantages and disadvantages. :)
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[18:23] <Chieftess> I've learned the hard way a few times.
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[18:23] <SAURI> hola
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[18:23] <kingjoshi> Super_George, maybe they were insulted at the offer?
[18:23] <Montezuma> Oh, guys I want to sleeep. Good night from Kazakhstan! See You later!
[18:24] <arkammler> I back
[18:24] <super_george_bush> i dunno
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[18:24] <@theGreyFox> I crawled out of my mothers stomach the hard way...
[18:24] <Lovro> Thunderfall, I hope you will not go to sleep like PH in there... I'm afraid of the hash-hammer
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[18:24] <Chieftess> I've also had a very challenging Systems Analysis class. :)
[18:24] <Bean> will the editor come with a unit creator? or will we have to use flicster
[18:24] <olearyma> Has there been any changes in the expected release of the patch (meaning, is it still expected this month)?
[18:24] <ButSam> Is there a way to generate better Archipelagos maps perchance? Thatwould really help...
[18:24] <Chieftess> strict discipline too.
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[18:24] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> Bean: From what I can tell, flicster is a better tool than what we forced on our artists....
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[18:24] <Chieftess> haha. :)
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[18:25] <ButSam> lol
[18:25] <super_george_bush> they want me to give them more for something that is FREE...greedy b!@#$%^&
[18:25] <super_george_bush> :D
[18:25] <+Soren> olearyma: I don't there has been a date announced. It has to pass testing, which could theoretically take quite a bit longer if it fails. It's a cycle, which is very difficult to predict.
[18:25] <kingjoshi> Chieftess, I've taken so many programming, systems, CS courses but have little "out-of-class" experience, but it always seems they want a lot of the latter
[18:25] <olearyma> understandable, thanks Soren
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[18:25] <Chieftess> true.. :)
[18:25] <arkammler> see you later, after dinner.
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[18:25] <ButSam> Firaxis, do you do any out-of-house beta testing? Wanna start with me? ;)
[18:26] <Chieftess> Firaxis wants a 3D programmer... I can't even draw (or program) something in 3D if I tried. :)
[18:26] <+Soren> SuperGeorge: I think that was to prevent some other exploit, although it may have been fixed in a patch. not a big deal, though.
[18:26] <MuddyOne> Soren, what is the term for game AI developers- I heard it before but can't recall it.
[18:26] <Chieftess> My isometric grids start looking glitchy (on paper!).
[18:26] <kingjoshi> super_george, maybe they feel that you're insulting them by suggesting they're inferior by giving them something for free :)
[18:26] <Lovro> ct, get a 3d paper... or invent one
[18:26] <@theGreyFox> that's me in the future maybe... 3D programmer that is.
[18:26] * super_george_bush airdrops paratroopers from his parkville area home into firaxis territory (hunt valley)
[18:26] <IHATEmedschool> also, some customer feedback from me, i'd like an option to view city radiuses in the main map, and one to be able to start the civs in their original positions on the real world map
[18:26] <Chieftess> I'll be the game designer. :-)
[18:26] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> ButSam: we have a beta team and take applications periodically. We usually announce them on CivFanatics (and apolyton)
[18:26] <Graeme999> Will satelites be implemented? I was very disappointed to see satelites for research, but not for use! It would be great (like the old empire) to be able to launch from a city, orbit for 80 turns and be able to see what's "under" the satelite.
[18:26] <Lovro> i'll be the Soren :)
[18:26] <@theGreyFox> I will be Programmer/Designer/Artist...
[18:27] <kingjoshi> IIRC, that was to fix people from giving crappy cities for other stuff
[18:27] <ButSam> sweet!!! I'll keep my eye out, thanks Mike :)
[18:27] <Chieftess> And force the programmers to not hard code everything. :)
[18:27] <+Soren> "game developer" is the catch-all phrase
[18:27] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> Chieftess: good luck wiht that one.
[18:27] <Lovro> Mike, not the A word! ;)
[18:27] <super_george_bush> lol
[18:27] <kingjoshi> I also want to be a game developer, but will get my PhD first.
[18:27] <olearyma> ok, gotta run, thanks for the quick answer and thanks for making such a cool game that'll be a whole lot cooler soon :)
[18:27] <Chieftess> haha... I made hard coded code once (in an RPG I was trying to make)..
[18:27] <@Thunderfall> Can beta testers let people know that they are beta testers (bu not reveal any classified game info)? ;)
[18:28] <Chieftess> learned the hard way that, that would be coding in every event in the compiler! :D
[18:28] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> Hard-coding is what makes the editor take longer to implement
[18:28] <+Soren> a PhD is definetly not required for making games ;) not that you shouldn't get it...
[18:28] <kingjoshi> TF, carefully read over the NDA :)
[18:28] <Lovro> let people know = user cp->edit profile... :)
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[18:28] <@theGreyFox> Why can't we swedes be Beta Testers?
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[18:28] <ButSam> Firaxis, are there any plans to bring back the wait until the spacecraft hits Alpha Centauri for victory? (Or a good reason why this was changed?) The old way was better, in my opinion...
[18:28] <IHATEmedschool> anybody mind explaining to me what is meant by hardcoding?
[18:28] * Chieftess tells Fox to come to Baltimore. It's a great city!
[18:28] <kingjoshi> Soren, yeah I know. but my dad is getting one and I've been set on a PhD since I was a child.
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[18:29] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> GreyFox - Don't know. legal reasons
[18:29] <kingjoshi> i was considering joining someone and working on an XBOX game, but decided grad school
[18:29] <ButSam> medschool, it means making something unflexible
[18:29] <super_george_bush> mike: if it takes longer to implement features into the editor if you hard-code it, why the heck did ya hard code it then?! "D
[18:29] <super_george_bush> :D*
[18:29] <+Soren> hardcoded means you can't change it without recompiling the game
[18:29] <@Thunderfall> poor kingjoshi... :D
[18:29] * @theGreyFox might take Chieftes up on that if he ever goes to the States
[18:29] <Lovro> and it's easier to do for Soren ;)
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[18:29] <kingjoshi> super_george, because a hack works :)
[18:29] <Chieftess> Sort of like saying "The terrian is terrain.jpg" and not have a text file to change it. :)
[18:29] <Bean> Butsam: The new spaceship requires all pieces before take-off so who every builds it first gets there first
[18:29] <MuddyOne> Medschool, instead of having the program look up in a table or INI file you put assign a hard value to it.
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[18:29] <IHATEmedschool> ahaaaaaaaaaaaaa
[18:29] <super_george_bush> ok
[18:30] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> super-george: I didn't.... I have to unhard-code it. And I think "hacking" falls into the hard-coding territory.
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[18:30] <ButSam> yes, but in the old one, true story, someone launched before me, but I built a faster ship and launched, and won :)
[18:30] <super_george_bush> oh
[18:30] <Chieftess> And just to think I was going to do that with my first RPG (events...) *shudders*
[18:30] <super_george_bush> so you gotta soft code it then? :D
[18:30] <kingjoshi> yes, definitely. hacking is hard coding. also goes into the unplanned, ill-prepared for category as well
[18:30] <+Soren> a lot (actually almost all) of the hard coding predates Mike and my time here at Firaxis.
[18:30] <Chieftess> "If tile 3,5 == c, go to this city" (it glitched there too!)
[18:31] <Bean> that was in civ2 when you could launch a craft with very little structural
[18:31] <+Soren> i don't remember the rationale for changing the spaceship rules. I think we had a desire to shorten the game from 40 to 39 hours. :)
[18:31] <ButSam> true--it does take more
[18:31] <ButSam> lol@Soren
[18:31] <IHATEmedschool> anyways
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[18:31] <kingjoshi> isak, welcome back
[18:31] <IHATEmedschool> thanks firaxis for your time, but i gotta studying for this damned med exam tomorrow
[18:31] <IHATEmedschool> good bye
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[18:31] <Graeme999> No one loves satelites???
[18:32] <ButSam> I think Satellites would be awesome :)
[18:32] <kingjoshi> Soren, have you played the DYP mod? do you know if any Civ3 employees have?
[18:32] * super_george_bush loves satellites
[18:32] <Bean> I don't really like the spaceship win anyway
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[18:32] <ButSam> gotta provide an option to blow ém out of the sky too though
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[18:32] <kingjoshi> good luck medschool
[18:32] <Graeme999> They used to be in the old empire (mid-80s) they were great!
[18:32] <[-ISAK-]> hi kingjoshi
[18:32] <+Soren> king: i haven't seen it...
[18:32] <Chieftess> I'd like to see the antiquity era expanded a bit..
[18:32] <Graeme999> I would love to see them back in Civ3!
[18:32] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> king: I don't know if anyone's played it but if anyone has I woudl expect Jeff or Barry/speedbump to have played it.
[18:32] <@Thunderfall> Mike, can u answer this quetsion from Isak? "Will we be able to change the default production of the center city tile in the upcoming editor?"
[18:32] <ButSam> I also think an option like Test of Time would be cool...continue on in Alpha Centauri while also running your Earth colony...but that's a stretch I know :)
[18:32] <@theGreyFox> anyone here played my WW2 mod?
[18:32] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> TF: not sure yet.
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[18:33] <[-ISAK-]> Soren : I can send it to you - Its only 20 mb ;-)
[18:33] <IHATEmedschool> thanks king
[18:33] <@Thunderfall> ok, thanks. Iska sent that Q to me thru the forum PM. :)
[18:33] <+Soren> hmmm....
[18:33] <Lovro> gf, nice website! not quite functional, though :(
[18:33] <+Mike_B_FIRAXIS> OK guys, time for me to check out. Thanks for coming to the chat! And thanks for playing.
[18:33] <ButSam> (the other ToT things weren't so good in my opinion...but that one rocked...and made the game 80 hours ;)
[18:33] <super_george_bush> cya mike!
[18:33] <@Thunderfall> Thanks a ton, Mike!
[18:33] <Novaya> Thanks, Mike. ^_^
[18:33] <ButSam> thank you very much Mike!
[18:33] <Chieftess> bye!
[18:33] <Lovro> if you are the one who made it, of course
[18:33] <[-ISAK-]> sorry thunderfall - got confused initially :-)
[18:33] <Lovro> bye mike!!
[18:33] <Bolan> Firaxis dudes, Thanks for your answers, got to go
[18:33] <Bean> Bye mikey
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[18:33] <maniacalmonkey> bye mike, thanks for all the answers!
[18:33] <+Soren> I gotta run too... sorry guys, I'll try to stay longer next time.
[18:33] <@theGreyFox> i have to much work to get the WW2 mod don, nor the site for it...
[18:33] <@Thunderfall> 5N o 5P roblem Isak. :D
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[18:33] <@theGreyFox> Buy, thanks!
[18:33] <kingjoshi> Thanks mike. have a good day :)
[18:33] <+Soren> adios
[18:34] <kingjoshi> ciao soren
[18:34] <@Thunderfall> Bye Soren.
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[18:34] <[-ISAK-]> bye Firaxis
[18:34] <ButSam> thanks Soren!
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[18:34] <@theGreyFox> I usually get the Graphics for my sites done, then I never fill them with Info...
[18:34] <ButSam> well, that was really cool of them, and they stayed a lot longer than I expected :)
[18:34] <@Thunderfall> That's it. :) The chat is officially over, although u are welcome to stay and chat!
[18:34] <Lovro> bye, Soren, it's always nice to talk to the "game developer" ;)
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[18:34] <@Thunderfall> Until next time we have a chat....
[18:34] <ButSam> thank you Thunderfall, GreyFox, and Pale (when you wake up)
[18:34] <Lovro> could you now /topic "After party"? :)
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[18:35] *** Thunderfall changes [topic] to 'After Party'
[18:35] <ButSam> anyone have deep burning questions on Civ3 (strategy, etc)?
[18:35] <Lovro> woohoo! :)
[18:35] <Sedennial> I have the entire day logged if anyone wants a copy of it raw I can dcc it to you (for those not using the Java chat client).
[18:35] <TBay_rangers85> all you first timers to the chat, come back and see us sometime
[18:35] <IHATEmedschool> yeah
[18:35] <IHATEmedschool> i do have one
[18:35] <kingjoshi> Yeah, thanks TF for setting this up
[18:35] <IHATEmedschool> before i go
[18:35] <@Thunderfall> Thanks everyone for coming!
[18:35] <Bean> I have a request I'm not very good at unit creating but this is probably really easy
[18:35] <@Thunderfall> I am produly claim I am no longer a newbie in this kind of things. :D
[18:35] <Chieftess> It seemed even busier than that "other place" when they had a chat.
[18:35] <maniacalmonkey> ok gotta go - take care everyone
[18:35] <Chieftess> :)
[18:35] <IHATEmedschool> can a city's radius grow above 21 squares?
[18:35] <@Thunderfall> am=can
[18:35] <chiefP> good job, TF
[18:35] <Lovro> applause for TF!
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[18:35] <Lovro> :)
[18:36] <ButSam> hehehehe and you did good too, Thunderfall
[18:36] <@Thunderfall> THnaks. :D
[18:36] <ButSam> fooled me that you ever were a newbie
[18:36] <@Thunderfall> Next time it will be even better!!!!!
[18:36] <ButSam> maybe 15 years ago...
[18:36] <Lovro> (except for that slight disconnection problem we won't mention)
[18:36] <TBay_rangers85> that's because this one was pre-announced, and the Poly chat was an impromptu all of a sudden thing
[18:36] <Bean> could someone change the color of the submarines to work with snoopy's oceans or tell me how to do it
[18:36] <Chieftess> What problem? :-)
[18:36] <Sedennial> Thanks TF! I'll get your email off the forums and send you info on that bot and go hunting for it this weekend if I get a chance.
[18:36] <MuddyOne> medschool not workable area
[18:36] <@Thunderfall> Thanks Seden
[18:36] <ButSam> I think moderated worked good initially when everyone was dying to say something...even if it was just "Did you see the Rangers game yesterday?
[18:37] <IHATEmedschool> ah
[18:37] <IHATEmedschool> thungs muddy
[18:37] <@Thunderfall> The beginng of the chat was quiet chaotic. i thought it wouldn't work well with modration on. :D
[18:37] <ButSam> but at the end things going unmodded was good b/c it saved your fingers and our griefs :)
[18:37] <TBay_rangers85> that's why we were talking in another room
[18:37] <IHATEmedschool> thanks muddy
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[18:37] <MuddyOne> medschool, 21 workable tiles- culture can extend further
[18:37] <Lovro> log from hash-demogame:
[18:37] <Lovro> [22:11] <Lovro> i anticipate he'll moderate it back in 5 mins or so
[18:37] <ButSam> my only suggestion is next time try to get an estimated amount of time they will be here and post that as well
[18:37] <Lovro> [22:14] <TBay_rangers85> THANK GOD, MODERATION AGAIN
[18:37] <Lovro> :)
[18:37] <@Thunderfall> hehe
[18:37] <TBay_rangers85> at the start it had to be moderated, otherwise you'd have 50 questions at once
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[18:38] <ButSam> agreed, TBay
[18:38] <@Thunderfall> I still have much to learn....
[18:38] <ButSam> but the change was also welcome when things died down some
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[18:38] <Chieftess> You mean I came in on the "calm" part!? :-)
[18:38] <MuddyOne> A suggestion for future Chats- start another channel as well so people can chat while waiting on answers :)
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[18:38] <ButSam> lol yes, actually
[18:38] <TBay_rangers85> yeah, when everyone pretty much got the majority of their questions out of the way, that's when the unmoderated was feasible
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[18:38] <Lovro> muddyone go to hash-demogame
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[18:38] <@Thunderfall> Aeson is sleeping? :)
[18:38] <TBay_rangers85> actually, we were using the #demogame room to chat
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[18:39] <Lovro> i think it would be wiser for everyone to post their questions in the fora, then have a "chosen tribe" ask the firaxians the questions
[18:39] <ButSam> good suggestion
[18:39] <[-ISAK-]> Big thanks for the Moderators - especially the insistent ones who should be in marketing ;-)
[18:39] <ButSam> lol
[18:39] <Sedennial> anybody else want the log? It's about 250kB
[18:39] <ButSam> I do! But you can't send it to me ;)
[18:39] <@Thunderfall> I will post an unedited and edited versions log later tonight or tomorrow.
[18:39] <TBay_rangers85> yeah, because questions were being fired so fast, a lot of questions got skipped over and never answered
[18:39] <@Thunderfall> Firaxians answered so many questions. :)
[18:39] <TBay_rangers85> next time, you might consider slowing down the rate of questions
[18:40] <Sedennial> well fine then
[18:40] <ButSam> they really did :)
[18:40] <Lovro> everyone who wants a log of hash-demogame report to me :)
[18:40] * Sedennial whaps ButSam
[18:40] <chiefP> yest they di
[18:40] <@theGreyFox> I'm cleaning up the LOG
[18:40] <@Thunderfall> good idea Tbay
[18:40] <ButSam> hehehehehe
[18:40] <@theGreyFox> and makin a Q&A of it
[18:40] <ButSam> try...see if Java lets ya ;)
[18:40] <Chieftess> I wanna read the logs! :)
[18:40] <@Thunderfall> hehe... have fun Grey Fox. :)
[18:40] <Chieftess> Any glitches?
[18:40] <Sedennial> hmm
[18:40] <@Thunderfall> what glicthes?
[18:40] <Sedennial> ok, lets see if it does :)
[18:40] <Chieftess> in the chat?
[18:40] <Sedennial> maybe it'll crash :)
[18:40] <Chieftess> That is, anything go wrong?
[18:40] <Chieftess> Or as planned?
[18:40] <@Thunderfall> it booted a dozne people put once.
[18:41] <@Thunderfall> but that;s all. :)
[18:41] <ButSam> ok this may seem silly of me to ask...but what server is this on? I have IRC on my comp at home, and just wanna know
[18:41] <Sedennial> netsplit
[18:41] <ButSam> sure thing, go for it Sedennial
[18:41] <TBay_rangers85> irc.webmaster.com
[18:41] <ButSam> if it crashes I'll blame Microsoft
[18:41] <MuddyOne> He was on the correct side of the net split so didn't lose anything
[18:41] <ButSam> thanks TBay :)
[18:41] <@Thunderfall> haha
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[18:41] <Sedennial> [15:44] *** Sent DCC SEND request to ButSamButSam: [15:44] *** ButSam does not wish to receive that message
[18:41] <Sedennial> heh
[18:41] <Lovro> lol
[18:41] <ButSam> you're right I don't!
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[18:41] <Sedennial> lol
[18:41] <ButSam> I'll show you what to do with that message!
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[18:42] <Bean> well I'm going to go crush the japanese see you all later
[18:42] <kingjoshi> Well, I gotta go now. thanks again to the moderators. have a good day everyone
* End *